NEW CLASS / SERIES; Historic Sports Sedans. formation meeting.20/04/13 ACC

[AMCO72]

What are you saying Jim.....that a Mini MIGHT beat a Sports Sedan, and if so you would only like to see them running around in the lunch break.!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Paul Wilkinson]

So they'll start with a small group of cars that can never get any bigger? I suppose that's okay if the intention is for a couple of novelty races a year.

[jim short]

Paul if you are so keen I am shure there will some for sale, why do want to change historey or are you mates of Chris Finnlyson ??

[jim short]

What are you saying Jim.....that a Mini MIGHT beat a Sports Sedan, and if so you would only like to see them running around in the lunch break.!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Amco you know there is nothing beter than enjoying a good meal ,and to be able to see and hear all those Minis buzzing around at the same time,as to the speed of the Mini ,cant say I know but Roger Freeth worked out at 8000Rpm in 5th was 168 mph,,dont think I would enjoy that speed in a Mini then again perhaps I would

[aussiemonza]

Would the restored ex Art McKee IMSA Monza be OK for this Series in 1977 spec?

[Paul Wilkinson]

It depends what you want I suppose. A pure historic field would be good but you will have a large performance differential across the different years and numbers will always be limited despite the best intentions. The alternative is to open it up to cars of the same spec - they were manufactured at the same time, it's not like these are new cars we're talking about. History has already happened, unless you have a particularly high-spec DeLorean there is nothing we can do to change it. It has happened, it is over. An RX2 coupe that ran in Sports Sedans back in the 80's would be eligible for the new class. An RX2 coupe to the exact same spec wouldn't be. That isn't preserving history, it's creating a class that is already limited in size and scope. Bringing back a vibrant class that allows these old cars to race again amongst similar machinery is preserving history. The cars with the history would still be the stars. If I run an RX2 coupe in this new class does that now mean that Tony Rutherford's car was never the National Champ? Does it mean that Tony's old car would lose its place in Sports Sedan history? If it does then you are absolutely right.

[CUSTAXIE50]

Would the restored ex Art McKee IMSA Monza be OK for this Series in 1977 spec?

NO.

[John McKechnie]

If there are no rules yet, why would this not be allowed?
This is a well known South Island car

[Jac Mac]

[color="#0000CD"]All getting a bit ahead of things here, George suggested that the initial meeting at the ACC & who actually fronts up with intent to compete/take part in the series will largely decide the format for the series.
If the handicapping is spot on & Gerald or Angus take part in the Mini I would love to hear the comments from within the Mini as they glance in the mirror about 200 meters from the finish line, the view should be about 4 rows of wall to wall thunder....[/color]

[Steve Holmes]

Would the restored ex Art McKee IMSA Monza be OK for this Series in 1977 spec?

Yes I would have thought so Rowan, based on the list George posted. Your car should almost certainly be accepted. By the way, how are you progressing with it?

[bry3500]

Great list. If only we could somehow combine it with the Group U Aussie Sports Sedans.

[CUSTAXIE50]

Yes I would have thought so Rowan, based on the list George posted. Your car should almost certainly be accepted. By the way, how are you progressing with it?

Yes i have looked at the list George put up ,cars like Graham Barnes capri chev are the ones to run in this new class,but this list says you can run any bag of bolts.

[George Sheweiry]

Sorry guys, went out to Puke today (free pass from my bro, Clive at boc gases for food and bevvys in boc hospitality tent), so haven't checked this but big sorry to Jim who was always there in the big black Porsche but while I was writing the list got interrupted and stuffed up!! Sorry to anyone else who is not on there but you will be warmly welcomed to the meeting. Wow what fantastic discussion about what car is eligible and what isn't and that is just the sort of thing we need to hear to be able to form this class. With more thought on the matter my own idea would be along the lines of cars that want to compete would need to submit photos, drawings, magazine articles etc of the car from the period they were wanting it to represent, and from people I have talked to this seems to be the consensus. From a lot of other classes I have run in it has always annoyed me that I had to run my cars to a set of rules that was either just thrust upon us or rules that were made by people who had plenty to say but never ever fronted to race. So another idea for the formation of the class is to do voting by points like 2 points per vote from people who have already raced and 1 point from the people who have never raced before. Also to protect all the members and their valuable cars a 3 knocks and your out or 1 race stand down , whatever. but I think you see where I am coming from. Of course the wider the inclusion of categories the more likely it will be to have a good field. The minimum vehicles for a stand alone race for the ACC is 10 or we get combined with another suitable class on that day which I think is fair enough on the car clubs side of things. Anyway great discussions Guys , keep up the good work. Cheers, George.

[aussiemonza]

NO.

It is the genuine car?

[bry3500]

.....and Pete the Punter jokingly calls from the back of the room "Custaxie 2 too please! "

[jim short]

[ I forgive you George I thought you were stiil upset from me jumping you at the start,or did I dream that bit?? I love the line Rules thrust upon us by those that never front,,how true,, I am all excited and started training today ,made the letterbox and back in one go ,, bring on to,,morrow QUOTE=George Sheweiry;27323]Sorry guys, went out to Puke today (free pass from my bro, Clive at boc gases for food and bevvys in boc hospitality tent), so haven't checked this but big sorry to Jim who was always there in the big black Porsche but while I was writing the list got interrupted and stuffed up!! Sorry to anyone else who is not on there but you will be warmly welcomed to the meeting. Wow what fantastic discussion about what car is eligible and what isn't and that is just the sort of thing we need to hear to be able to form this class. With more thought on the matter my own idea would be along the lines of cars that want to compete would need to submit photos, drawings, magazine articles etc of the car from the period they were wanting it to represent, and from people I have talked to this seems to be the consensus. From a lot of other classes I have run in it has always annoyed me that I had to run my cars to a set of rules that was either just thrust upon us or rules that were made by people who had plenty to say but never ever fronted to race. So another idea for the formation of the class is to do voting by points like 2 points per vote from people who have already raced and 1 point from the people who have never raced before. Also to protect all the members and their valuable cars a 3 knocks and your out or 1 race stand down , whatever. but I think you see where I am coming from. Of course the wider the inclusion of categories the more likely it will be to have a good field. The minimum vehicles for a stand alone race for the ACC is 10 or we get combined with another suitable class on that day which I think is fair enough on the car clubs side of things. Anyway great discussions Guys , keep up the good work. Cheers, George.[/QUOTE]

[Steve Holmes]

Yes i have looked at the list George put up ,cars like Graham Barnes capri chev are the ones to run in this new class,but this list says you can run any bag of bolts.

OK, before you start insulting people, calling their cars a "bag of bolts", try doing your homework first. The car aussiemonza is referring to is the Grant King Chevy Monza built in the US to race in IMSA. It competed alongside the early DeKon Monza's, including DeKon 1001, which was eventually purchased by Red Dawson and shipped to New Zealand. The King Monza was purchased in 1976 by reigning Castrol GTX champion Art McKee to race in the 1977 New Zealand Saloon Car Championship.

It raced alongside the Sidchrome Mustang, Nazer Victor, Bill Leckie Capri, Dawson Monza, PDL Mustang II etc, and is an important piece of NZ motorsport history.

McKee sold the car following the 1977 season to an Australian buyer, and it raced in Australian Sports Sedan events for the next 20 - 25 years, before being purchased by Rowan (aussiemonza) who has been in the process of restoring it back to its Art McKee guise as it raced in NZ. Its a significant car with great Sports Sedan history. Nuff said.

[John McKechnie]

And it would be huge to see this magic car racing here again.
You have a good fan base here in Kiwiland , Rowan,

[crunch]

My personal plea would be for the cars to run as they were in period. No modern modifications, but enjoy what they were...a piece of history that is as exciting to watch today as it was way back then when I was a spotty faced teenage flag marshall at Manfield.

[CUSTAXIE50]

OK, before you start insulting people, calling their cars a "bag of bolts", try doing your homework first. The car aussiemonza is referring to is the Grant King Chevy Monza built in the US to race in IMSA. It competed alongside the early DeKon Monza's, including DeKon 1001, which was eventually purchased by Red Dawson and shipped to New Zealand. The King Monza was purchased in 1976 by reigning Castrol GTX champion Art McKee to race in the 1977 New Zealand Saloon Car Championship.

It raced alongside the Sidchrome Mustang, Nazer Victor, Bill Leckie Capri, Dawson Monza, PDL Mustang II etc, and is an important piece of NZ motorsport history.

McKee sold the car following the 1977 season to an Australian buyer, and it raced in Australian Sports Sedan events for the next 20 - 25 years, before being purchased by Rowan (aussiemonza) who has been in the process of restoring it back to its Art McKee guise as it raced in NZ. Its a significant car with great Sports Sedan history. Nuff said.

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Im not insulting people at all Steve,calling their cars a bag of bolts its just a saying i think most would know that.over the years a lot of drivers have said this to me about their cars.I dont think anyone on here is going to get to upset about it.Look at it this way 45 years ago thats all some had, and put their bag of bolts together to make a race car.