ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

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Expand view Topic review: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by stubuchanan » Wed Jan 04, 2012 10:53 am

David McKinney wrote:Nice try, Stu, but why did the earlier reference make the statement that Tasmania was an island to the south-east of Australia? (And in any case, as any fule kno, it's an Australian island to the south-east of the mainland)


In support of my statements, I point out that Wikipedia(Italian version) states that the Tasman Sea is known as Mar Tasman or Mar Tasmania in Italian. The Italian writer obviously took the second option and referred to the Tasman Championship as "Il Campionato di Tasmania". How good is your Italian, I could always email you a copy of the magazine article!

Stu

Shuter/Hoare Ferrari

by stubuchanan » Wed Jan 04, 2012 10:34 am

Photographic proof of the continued existence of the Ferrari 625 hybrid(after the 1961 accident) is on page 130 of Vercoe's "Historic Racing Cars...". The car has the permanent number plate 'AQ3343' showing - these plates weren't issued until about 1964/65. In spite of Vercoe's comments the car was rebuilt in NZ and driven at Wigram by Shuter junior(?) in the photo.

Stu

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by bry3500 » Wed Jan 04, 2012 1:25 am

jim short wrote:its just been put on my facebook its in holland i thought it srashed into a {triumph mayflower}??? at wigram

check post #198
http://www.theroaringseason.com/showthread.php?321-Who-What-and-Where/page10

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by jim short » Wed Jan 04, 2012 12:59 am

its just been put on my facebook its in holland i thought it srashed into a {triumph mayflower}??? at wigram

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by David McKinney » Mon Jan 02, 2012 4:49 pm

stubuchanan wrote:The 'Tasmania' reference from "Ferrari, I Quattro Cilindri" may be an incorrect Italian name for Australasia. See attached cover from 'Auto Italiana' 11.1.1968, referring to the Tasman Championship of that year. Their article was a translation of a piece by Eoin Young, and the translator seems to have been confused between Tasmania the island and the Tasman Championship.

Stu

Image


Nice try, Stu, but why did the earlier reference make the statement that Tasmania was an island to the south-east of Australia? (And in any case, as any fule kno, it's an Australian island to the south-east of the mainland)

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by bry3500 » Mon Jan 02, 2012 12:35 pm

David McKinney wrote:The nose certainly doesn't look right - maybe it's the camera angles

Agree David, the nose looks more tapered..maybe from the Wigram accident rebuild?

Tasmania

by stubuchanan » Mon Jan 02, 2012 10:12 am

David McKinney wrote:Hi Peter

I should have picked this up before

The car should not be referred to as a Tasman Ferrari (and certainly never had anything to do with Tasmania...)

Until 1963, the word 'Tasman' was the name of a Dutch explorer and the sea he named between Australia and New Zealand. It was adopted by the organisers of international races in those countries for a new championship ie, the Tasman Series, taking effect in 1964.

And even if there had been a Tasman Series before that, it would still be incorrect to use the term for Hoare's car - be bought it for racing in New Zealand, and never once raced it in Australia


The 'Tasmania' reference from "Ferrari, I Quattro Cilindri" may be an incorrect Italian name for Australasia. See attached cover from 'Auto Italiana' 11.1.1968, referring to the Tasman Championship of that year. Their article was a translation of a piece by Eoin Young, and the translator seems to have been confused between Tasmania the island and the Tasman Championship.

Stu

Image

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by jamie » Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:42 am

Me Agane and it still has the clear cover over the motor Jamie A

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by jamie » Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:38 am

Hi Gang I took some pitc of that same car ai FERRARI Oct 2010 it siill makes my ears ring just looking at it Jamie A

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by David McKinney » Sun Jan 01, 2012 5:07 pm

petgro wrote:Ferrari GP Monoposto 625 Tasman

The Ferrari Register – supplement one, by Dr. Robert B. Marvin:
625 Tasman 1957-1960.....

Ferrari, I Quattro Cilindri:
As its name, the Tasman, indicates, this model was destined for Tasmania, the island in the Pacific, to the South-east of Australia


Hi Peter

I should have picked this up before

The car should not be referred to as a Tasman Ferrari (and certainly never had anything to do with Tasmania...)

Until 1963, the word 'Tasman' was the name of a Dutch explorer and the sea he named between Australia and New Zealand. It was adopted by the organisers of international races in those countries for a new championship ie, the Tasman Series, taking effect in 1964.

And even if there had been a Tasman Series before that, it would still be incorrect to use the term for Hoare's car - be bought it for racing in New Zealand, and never once raced it in Australia

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by driftwood » Sun Jan 01, 2012 3:40 pm

i wonder how much the car was to buy back then and how much a house or mini was etc as a comparable
Im not interestd in the today silly million value thats just rich kids wanting to pee higher up the wall than
the rest of us and we can all build a replica for a lot less

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by David McKinney » Sat Oct 29, 2011 5:44 am

AMCO72 wrote:Wasn't it a cobbled up 'bitsa' with a sports car engine. Apparently was a cantankerous old bitch!!! [sorry thunder427]....it shouldn't have been with a fairly mildly tuned 4 cylinder engine with modest horse-power, compared to a GP. This is where I got ballsed up. Hoare going to Ferrari for a new engine for it and coming home with a complete car, a V12 at that. What a leap of faith....4 cylinders to 12. Now they, could be, and often were cantankerous....the Roycroft car for instance. Maybe it was our mechanics here in NZ who didnt quite understand these things, or maybe not enough money to keep them fresh, but none of these imports ever lived up to their name. Makes me feel very proud of our special builders here in NZ with their old flat-head V8's and Jag engined contraptions, that could sometimes give these things a run for their money. Always thought the Maserati was a far better car anyway, and I have to wonder why a historian would spend 15 years of his life researching a car that was unloved and clearly a dog. I think I have answered my own question....because he is a [an] Historian!!

Hoare raced the 4-cylinder car for three seasons - 1958 in detuned state, and not very competitive, 1959 kept breaking piston rings, 1960 fast and reliable and nearly won the Gold Star
The V12 was also fast and reliable - was second in the Gold Star in 1961 (to D Hulme, 2.5 Cooper-Climax) and won in 1962
Roycroft's problems with his earlier V12 were largely a result of budgetary restraints

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by Milan Fistonic » Sat Oct 29, 2011 4:01 am

A newspaper clipping from when Hoare was trying to sell the car.

[ATTACH]4358[/ATTACH]
Attachments
Hoare Ferrari 625.JPG

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by Howard Wood » Fri Oct 28, 2011 10:45 pm

The NZ inferiority complex extends to racing cars as well. The best of the NZ specials, from Muriwai beach racing specials to Formula Pacific are every bit as innovative and well built as many other much celebrated marques.

The second Hoare Ferrari was as rough as guts in many ways and not from dodgy repairs either. I have not seen the car since removing the "GTO" body but there is the conundrum for the restorer. Do you replicate, complete with flaws or rebuild as it should have been built (or to 21st century standards)?

Anthony Bamford of JCB fame/ fortune had a '70s F1 Ferrari which he wrapped around a tree "test driving" the thing up the driveway of his stately mansion and John Anderson rebuilt the tub. Subsequently the car was sent to Ferrai for its annual service/ WOF who angrily demanded to know who had been working unauthorised on the car, as the rivets all lined up!

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by AMCO72 » Fri Oct 28, 2011 5:51 pm

Wasn't it a cobbled up 'bitsa' with a sports car engine. Apparently was a cantankerous old bitch!!! [sorry thunder427]....it shouldn't have been with a fairly mildly tuned 4 cylinder engine with modest horse-power, compared to a GP. This is where I got ballsed up. Hoare going to Ferrari for a new engine for it and coming home with a complete car, a V12 at that. What a leap of faith....4 cylinders to 12. Now they, could be, and often were cantankerous....the Roycroft car for instance. Maybe it was our mechanics here in NZ who didnt quite understand these things, or maybe not enough money to keep them fresh, but none of these imports ever lived up to their name. Makes me feel very proud of our special builders here in NZ with their old flat-head V8's and Jag engined contraptions, that could sometimes give these things a run for their money. Always thought the Maserati was a far better car anyway, and I have to wonder why a historian would spend 15 years of his life researching a car that was unloved and clearly a dog. I think I have answered my own question....because he is a [an] Historian!!

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by stubuchanan » Fri Oct 28, 2011 11:06 am

pallmall wrote:Regarding the David Manton book, is it only available through online sources or is it going to be available in NZ bookstores?


I bought mine 2 or 3 months ago from The Book Depository of Gloucester UK total cost on my Visa was $46.48 NZ and it arrived in less than 2 weeks. You can find them easily via Google.

Re the nose and body shape, it doesn't look quite right to me either (David). Way back I wondered if it was a very original Lancia body from 1954, before Ferrari got at them. Doesn't look much like any Ferrari of the era.

Stu

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by GD66 » Fri Oct 28, 2011 8:29 am

It's $29.95 on amazon.com at the moment. Not listed at Pitstop Bookshop.

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by pallmall » Fri Oct 28, 2011 7:20 am

Regarding the David Manton book, is it only available through online sources or is it going to be available in NZ bookstores?

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by AMCO72 » Fri Oct 28, 2011 6:14 am

Yes OK, thanks for that forum link. The car certainly looks as though it's been through the wars. When the 'GTO' was sold to England minnus bodywork, and rerestored to 'original' ,I couldn't imagine the restorers putting up with 'welds' that are evident in some of the pictures..... Iv'e seen better at Cambridge High Schools' third form welding classes!!!! Is amazing what Ferrari palmed off on to us colonials, and is probably why it has ended it's days as a museum piece.

Re: ferrari 625 tasman - pat hoare

by GD66 » Fri Oct 28, 2011 2:24 am

[I'm not answering...] but that's another car entirely, mate.

Stand by for full info from The Fountain...


Or you could wander through this while you're waiting...

http://forums.autosport.com/index.php?showtopic=87195&hl=Pat+Hoare

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